Episode 34: Interview With Michelle Seiler Tucker, Best-Selling Author

Ep 34: Dawn McGruer Interviews Michelle Seiler Tucker, best-selling author for Dawn of a New Era Podcast ‘Chronicles of a Serial Entrepreneur’ 

In today’s episode, I’m speaking with Michelle Seiler Tucker, the best-selling author and the leading authority when it comes to buying, growing and fixing any type of business. We’re talking about exit strategies and setting your business up now so that you have a sellable business rather than a business dependent on you to run it.

We talk about Michelle’s book and how she buys, grows and fixes businesses and helps to ultimately make a business sellable with a boosted sale price.

🔥 Michelle Seiler Tucker is a two times #1 Best-Selling Author

🔥 The Founder and CEO of Seiler Tucker The Business Authorities

🔥 She has a track record of closing 90% of all listings and 99% of written offers

🔥 Michelle has over 20 years of experience with over a thousand businesses bought and sold.

🔥 Don’t forget to subscribe to the podcast – I have some pretty epics guest lined up for the next 3 months (yep I have been a busy bee!) and I promise the stories and insights my guests are going to be sharing are out of this world in terms of inspiring!!!

Did you know that my podcast Dawn of a New Era has reached the top 10% most popular shows out of 1,992,247 podcasts globally, ranked by Listen Score?… Just 8 months and 34 episodes in – SUBSCRIBE NOW
Interview with Michelle Seiler Tucker

Here are the highlights from the episode:

{2:21} How now is a great time to start a company

{5:33} The number one reason companies are closing down after COVID is that the industries they’re in are dying

{07:51} Selling your business when it’s in its prime

{09:50} How to make the transition from you being your company to having a sellable business

{11:51} Seeing your business as your most valuable asset and set it up for success

{13:19} Creating your exit plan using the GPS exit model

{16:02} The 5 types of buyer

{22:24} The biggest challenges for businesses over the next year

{28:42} Michelle’s final words of inspiration

Connect with Michelle at www.seilertucker.com

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Dawn McGruer’s Marketing * Motivation * Mindset Group    



 
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Multi-award-winning speaker, strategist & best-selling author of Dynamic Digital MarketingHelping to inspire entrepreneurs to rise to meet today’s challenges and be powerfully present to shine online.
 
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How now is a great time to start a company

Dawn McGruer: Now we have a special guest with us today, and some of you may have been reading her bio. I know a lot of you were very interested in the topic, because Michelle Seiler-Tucker is pretty much the leading authority when it comes to buying, growing, fixing any type of business. You’re probably very well known in the mergers and acquisitions side of things. Probably, is it 20 years you’ve been now working in this niche?

Michelle Seiler: Yeah, so about 20 years.

Dawn McGruer: Michelle’s going to be talking to us about all sorts of things to do with exit strategy. She’s going to be talking about growing your business, and tactics in terms of getting your business ready to sell. But also she’s going to be talking to us about her new book and you might see it in her background, it’s called Exit Rich. Now, when we go through, feel free to ask questions. If you are watching this on the live, then we will make sure that we cover everything. So, make sure that you put your questions in the chat. Michelle, first of all, tell us a little bit about this new book that’s just come out, because you’ve been on a fabulous journey. You’ve been in Forbes, you’re featured on all sorts of publications, radio shows. Tell us a little bit about you.

Michelle Seiler:

Sure. I’ve been in mergers and acquisitions, mastery and mediary for a little over 20 years. Before that I did franchise sells, franchise development, and franchise consulting. I’ve always owned multiple companies, at any given time I own five to 10 companies that I’m building to sell. So, I really specialize in buying, selling, fixing, and growing. And it’s my passion. Entrepreneurship is my passion. I wrote my first book, my very first book in 2013 called Sell Your Business for More Than It’s Worth. That book was more of just a blueprint on how to sell your business. When I did the research back then though, I learned that 90, 95% of startups would fail in the first one tp five years. Then several years later, I’ve been driving around and meeting clients all over the US and Canada.

Michelle Seiler:

I keep noticing that I’ll see a business there one day, next day, the business is completely gone. So, I started doing my research again and learned that in America, I’m not sure about the UK. But in America the business landscape has actually flip-flopped. So, it used to be that 95% of startups that would go out of business in the first one to five years are the most risky. Well, now it’s only 30%. Only 30% of startups are going out of business. So, this is the best time to start your business. However, on a 27.6 million companies about those businessesthat  have been in business 10 years or longer, 70% of those companies are going out of business. Seven zero, this is before COVID. So, you see how it’s flip-flopped. It used to be, if you can make it past five years, you’re golden. Your business is going to last a very long time.

Now, in America, and probably UK, you hear about the big box, public companies like Toys R Us, been in business 75 years goes under. KMart, Stein Mart, Pier 1, Godiva Chocolate closing down 1500 locations, GNC closing down 900 locations. But what the media is not telling us, is about all the private companies on every street corner, in every town and every state. And these business owners, unfortunately, are exiting poor. They’re having to sell for pennies on the dollar, close their business, or even worse file bankruptcy. So, Exit Ridge is very different than my first book, whereas it’s not just about selling your business. It’s actually about building a business that will stay in business. So it will be sustainable, scalable, and when you’re ready, you will actually have a sellable asset.

The number one reason companies are closing down after COVID is that the industries they’re in are dying

Dawn McGruer:

See, this is… I think you’ve hit the nail on the head. So many people are still thinking, and there’s a fear out there about starting businesses. But we’ve seen businesses that we know brands from growing up in our childhood and they’re going. What are the keys? If there were a critical success factor, what would be the key in terms of making your business strong and making it sellable?

Michelle Seiler:

The number one reason that businesses are going out of business, 70%, remember that’s before COVID. Now in America, every 10 seconds a business is closing down. There’s over 10,000 businesses, 10,000 restaurants that are going under. So, the number one key to success before COVID… We can give you before COVID and after COVID, because it’s two different things. Number one, success before COVID, the number one reason that businesses are going out of business is because they stopped doing what I call aim. Aim, A-I-M. Aim is always innovate and market. Business owners become complacent. They’re married to their concept. They’re married to their ideas. They keep doing things the way they’ve always done them. And they stopped innovating. They stopped marketing. And the problem is, if you don’t innovate… It’s like blockbuster, blockbuster sold Netflix. They had the opportunity to buy Netflix.

They did nothing to innovate. Toys R Us changed nothing in 75 years. So, if you don’t innovate, then there are going to be competitors that are going to innovate. They’re going to pass you by. Plus you’ve got some really strong entrepreneurs that are doing startups, and they’re looking at problems and finding solutions. So the company that makes it the easiest to purchase their products and services is the company that’s going to win. Amazon is winning, because Amazon makes it so easy. You can practically buy anything. You can practically buy a horse and have it delivered to you in two days. That’s the number one reason they’re going out of business.

As far as now, after COVID, one of the big issues is, the industries are dying. Industries that were dying before COVID are now thriving and vice versa. The industries like restaurants, hotels, et cetera, they just have to get creative. They have to think about how to do things differently. And I use COVID as a wake up call for everybody, because a lot of business owners have one profit center. They have all their eggs in one basket. Plus they have one or two months of working capital. You can’t operate like that. You should always have congruent revenue streams and be diversified. And you should always have at least one year of working capital.

Selling your business when it’s in its prime

Dawn McGruer:

I think so many people have heard about being dynamic, pivoting during COVID. We’ve seen some people come out, and they’re totally different businesses. They’re leaner, they’re stronger, and they’re working more towards the consumer trends and also what consumers want. This is something that I think we needed in business. As much as we don’t want the pandemic, there’s some businesses that will really thrive from this, because they have adapted, as you say. Then they’ve looked at innovation. We’ve seen actually a lot people investing in innovation during COVID, and using this downtime to research the market, look at their revenue streams and try and add in more. If you could go back to when you first got into obviously this career, have you seen the way that entrepreneurs do business change?

Michelle Seiler:

Yes and no. It used to be, when I first got into this industry, that a lot of entrepreneurs didn’t plan their exit because their plan was to pass their business onto their children. And a lot of them… You did see business family businesses go from generation to generation. Now, that’s really changed. I would say less than 10% of businesses are passed on to the next generation, because the kids don’t want your business. Things have Changed. Kids want to create their own masterpiece. They want to find their own way. They don’t necessarily want to follow in mommy and daddy’s footsteps.

So I always tell my business owners, you really need to plan your exit. I call this an exit rich, the ST GPS exit model, and you really need to plan your exit day one of buying or starting a business. And plan your business with the end in mind, then reverse engineer it. The problem is business owners never really think about selling. There’s five ways to exit, but business owners never really think about selling until they have to, due to an internal or external catastrophic event. That could be health issues, job, partners, divorce, or COVID. And when you’re trying to sell in the middle of the chaos, you’re not going to maximize value because your business is turning downward, not upward. Best time to sell is when your business is in its prime.

How to make the transition from you being your company to having a sellable business

Dawn McGruer:

Exactly. When you think about businesses, I meet millions and millions of people online who talk about having a business. And I think one of the fundamentals that we looked at when we look at online marketing is online presence and what your business model is. If you think about business models, so many people are their business, and that’s not sellable. How do people make that transition from being the business, to having something that is actually a business that they can sell, that they don’t need to be involved in and that they aren’t the whole foundation and structure?

Michelle Seiler:

You’re absolutely right. That’s probably the number two reason that businesses don’t sell. In the United States, probably UK too, because I think we marry each other. But in the United States, 80% of businesses won’t sell. That’s according to Steve Forbes. 80%, eight out of 10, that’s a pretty big number. And Steve Forbes actually endorsed my book Exit Rich. They don’t sell, because number one, a business owner never grew a business that a buyer actually wants to buy. They’ve created a glorified job and wants you to go to work every day, versus a business that works for them. That’s the number two reason, is that the business is dependent upon the owner.

Buyers aren’t buying jobs. Unless you have the right people in the right place and you have a management team, they’re not going to buy your company. They’ll pass on to the next. So, how do they make that transition? Well, first and foremost, they follow what I call the six Ps. They build their business to follow this infrastructure so that it is sustainable, scalable, can run without them. It’ll be profitable, then when they’re ready, it’s actually sellable. That very first P in the six Ps is people. You have to have people. Dawn, you don’t build a business, you build people and people build a business.

Entrepreneurs really have to get out of the mindset that this is my baby. No, you’ve got babies at home. This is your valuable asset. We want to build your most valuable asset so you can sell it for millions when you’re ready. So, you have to have the right people in the right position. And you have to ask the who question. Who opens the door, who handles customers, who handles marketing. Who handles legal, who handles accounting, who handles logistics, manufacturing, transportation, environmental, the list goes on and an. The clue here, Dawn, is you should never be next to the who.

Dawn McGruer:

Exactly.

Seeing your business as your most valuable asset and set it up for success

Michelle Seiler:

Because we really want to build a business that runs without you. I had a dentist that called me the other day, he’s been in business 45 years. One dentist, three dental hygienist. He goes, Michelle, I’m not going to stay for the new owner. And I go, then you don’t have a business for sale. I had a sweet little old lady called us a couple of months ago. Her husband dropped out of a heart attack, left her with a mountain of debt. And she said, “can you sell the business?” I started going through six Ps, and I said, “no, it’s not sellable.” Because he had a job. He had this business job for 40 some years. No employees whatsoever, no processes, no nothing. Everything was in his head. So, when he died, the business died. And unfortunately there was nothing to sell. Business owners really should think of their business as the most valuable asset and set it up for success, and make sure you leave a sellable asset for your family. And don’t leave a mountain of debt.

Creating your exit plan using the GPS exit model

Dawn McGruer:

I think people with product-based businesses, they tend to have… Because it’s very process driven, they start getting people into those processes. I often see the service-based businesses, when everyone’s got the knowledge in the head and that’s when they’re not hiring the teams, getting the people in, because it seems difficult. Is there a sweet spot in terms of, if you start a new business in terms of getting it sellable. Do you start right at the beginning with that mindset and grow it through?

Michelle Seiler:

Yeah. To me, you start from the beginning. And I don’t think it matters if it’s a product or a service business, because they all have to have processes. We’ve got a business right now that has two owners and everything… They have a product company, they fabricate. They can fabricate anything for anybody anytime, is what their slogan is. However, its two owners are in their seventies with four employees. When they pass or when they sell, who’s going to fabricate anything for anybody anytime. It’s not going to be the employees. So, you really have to have these infrastructures in place, even for online businesses, e-commerce businesses, et cetera. I’ll tell you about the GPS exit model really quickly. The biggest plan is, nobody goes in business to… Nobody plans to fail, they fail to plan. You always going to have that exit plan. And I say from day one that you start a business or buy a business, determine your end game. When you want to drive somewhere, you pull out your phone and you pull out Google maps, what’s the first thing you plug in? Your destination, right?

If you don’t plug in a destination, you’re not going to get anywhere. Or you’re just going to drive around in circles. That’s the same thing with business owners, is that they don’t have a plan, so they drive around in circles and drive up and down the financial Hills. Pick a number. Your destination in the ST GPS exit model is your end game, your desired sales price. Pick a number. You might hit it, you might not, but at least that’s the start of a plan.

Dawn McGruer:

You’re aiming toward something.

Michelle Seiler:

You want to aim for something, you want to drive toward something. So, let’s say you want to sell it for $20 million. It’s just a number. If your number is $5 million, great, that’s your number. If your number is a $100 million, great, that’s your number. Pick a number. I just want people to pick a number. Let’s say it’s $20 million, then you want to reverse engineer it. The GPS exit model now has your destination, but it needs to know where you’re starting from, and needs to know what your current evaluation, what are you worth today? Many business owners have never had a business valuation before. It’s completely financial suicide to me, because as humans, we’ll go to doctor and get a physical checkup to make sure that we’re still ticking and kicking.

We’ll drive a car to the shop and make sure our car is running on all six cylinders. But when it comes to the business, their most valuable asset, they never stop and get their business valuated. I worked with a company the other day for 50 years, 50 years in business, never one evaluation. You should get your business evaluated every single year, because there are events that increase valuation and events that decrease valuation. COVID is a perfect example of that. Let’s say you want to sell for 20 million, and you’re worth $5 million today. Now, you need to know timeframe. Let’s say you want to do this in 10 years. Great, 10 years.

Now you have a start of a plan. Now you need to know who’s my buyers going to be, not buyer, buyers. Because if you have one buyer… Sellers come to me all the time and say, “Michelle, I have a buyer, this buyer is going to buy.” I’m like, okay, yeah, let’s see. The buyer is not going to buy it. I’m like, I’ll put money on it. And the buyer never buys it. You always have to have multiple buyers, because if you put all of your eggs in one buyer’s basket, that buyer falls out, falls through, then what? Plus, how can you create competition? How can you get massive value? How can you get the best price if you have one buyer? You can’t.

The 5 types of buyer

Michelle Seiler:

There’s five types of buyers. So, if you’re trying to sell for $20 million, this is who’s not the buyer. It’s not going to be a first time buyer. They’re not going to buy your business because they buy small businesses, they can’t afford a $20 million company. A turnaround specialist is a second type of buyer, they buy distressed assets. The third type of buyer is private equity groups, PEGs. They buy based on platforms and addons. The fourth type of buyer is strategists and competitors. Now, these are typically the best buyers, because they’ll pay more for synergies.

Then the fifth buyer is a serial entrepreneur that’s industry agnostic, and they chase EBITDA, cashflow. EBITDA is earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation, and amortization. So, when you’re a business, when you want to sell your business for $20 million, not only do you have to know who the buyers are, but more importantly, you have to know what’s the financial criteria. What are the gross revenues have to be? Gross profit margins, most importantly the EBITDA. If you want to sell for $20 million, you need to have an EBITDA between three to $5 million. Then you need to know what synergies are they looking for? Go ahead.

Dawn McGruer:

Exactly. If somebody is in a business, give us an idea of if they would go and get Exit Rich, is this going to give them walk throughs of these processes you’re talking about? Will they be able to start mapping things out and getting an idea of where they are in the process?

Michelle Seiler:

Well, they still need to get an evaluation. My book Exit Rich is all about planning your exit from day one, going through what I call the sellers’ sanity check. When should you sell? Looking at your business and looking at your life, when should you sell? It gives you the steps. Plus, it gives you the steps to build the business on the infrastructure with the six Ps. And build their synergies, because here’s the deal, buyers buy synergies. Valuation depends upon not only how high your EBITDA is, but more importantly what synergies you’ve created. We know the buyers, so we should bring the buyers and we can create a bidding war. Because we can bring two, three, four, 500 buyers to one deal, because we know the players and we know who’s going to pay what for what synergies. That’s how we are able to get 20, 40, 65% higher selling prices for our clients. Our last deal was 126% more than what the business priced for.

Dawn McGruer:

Wow, amazing. There’ll be many people listening to this thinking, how did you get in to this business? Where did you start? Did you wake up one day and think this is where I want to be. Did you fall into it? What was your career background?

Michelle Seiler:

No, I never woke up and said, “Oh my gosh, I’m going to sell businesses.” I always knew I was going to be in sales, because I’m a people person. I actually went to medical school and realized very quickly that wasn’t good for me. But I always knew I was going to be in sales. I’ve always been in sales. I always knew I was going to sell high ticket items. I’ve always owned businesses. I knew I was going to be an entrepreneur. I’ve always been a writer. And I have owned quite many different businesses in many different verticals. Then I did go to work for Xerox for a short period of time, because they recruited me. My nickname at Xerox was a closer, because every time they couldn’t close something, they would call me. They were like get Michelle to do it, she can close this, she can close anything.

Then my manager came to me and said, “Michelle, you really should apply for the regional vice president position,” over 95 sales people. And she goes, you’ll never get it, because you’ve only been here six months and Xerox requirement is two years and you’re applying against people who’ve been here for years and years. I’m like, why would I ever apply for something I’m never going to get? And she said, “because of the experience, because of the learning.” She goes, you’re going to learn so much during this three month process that it’s worth the experience. And I said, “okay, I’ll do it.”

So I did it. It was a three month process. She was right, it was a grueling process with all these high level executives. We had to do Q&As with them, presentations, demonstrations. Even though I was told I would never get it, I got it. So, I got promoted into vice president, and I hated it. I hated it, because doing management… I love leadership, I love management, but I don’t love management in a Fortune 500 company. That’s not me, because I like to get things done. I like, I see a problem, I find a solution and I implement it right away. Well, with corporate America, Fortune 500 companies, you have to have a meeting to schedule another meeting, to schedule a follow-up meeting.

Yeah. So, I just didn’t like it. Anyway, I ended up transitioning out of that and going into franchise sales, franchise consulting. My clients kept asking me, my buyers kept asking me, do you have an existing business? Because we don’t want franchising. We don’t want somebody to tell us what to do all the time. And I’m like, I don’t, but why shouldn’t I. I can. So, that’s how I opened up my M&A firm. I first started selling small businesses, then very quickly graduated to selling… We sell 10 million and up. Now I do have agents who sell businesses under 10 million, but my sweet spot is 10 and up.

Then I learned very quickly that eight out of 10 businesses don’t sell. Then I started fixing businesses. So, I really specialize in buying, fixing, selling, growing. I partner with business owners investing my money, time, energy, effort. Then I put them on that build to sell exit model that I just told you about. I also buy businesses and flip them, we merge businesses together, and then we sell businesses. So, at any given time, I own five to 10 businesses that I’m building to sell as well.

The biggest challenges for businesses over the next year

Dawn McGruer:

We’ve talked a lot about the pandemic, what’s happened, being dynamic and synergies in places. What is the future? What do you see is the biggest challenge for businesses in the next like three, six, 12 months?

Michelle Seiler:

Well, it really depends upon the industry. Some industries are having their best year ever. Agriculture is doing great. Of course, your store chains are doing amazing. Transportation is doing good. Anything home-related, home construction, home renovation, swimming pools. I mean, people aren’t traveling, so they’re spending more money on their homes than ever before. So ,you really got to look at the industry and say, “okay, well, what’s the future for that industry?” Restaurants are going to bounce back. Everybody is so tired of being home and not being out. Like I said earlier, I think this needs to be a wake up call that business owners need to do things differently. We need to have multiple revenue streams. I’m diversified, one business doesn’t go well, I have four others.

I learned a long time ago in New Orleans, Louisiana when hurricane Katrina hit. I had all my business in new Orleans, 95% of my companies literally went underwater with hurricane Katrina. And I told myself back then, I will never just be in New Orleans. I will have businesses everywhere. So now, I do. I think, we really have to look at our business with a different set of eyes. We need to treat our business as an asset, not as a kid. We really need to grow that business and make sure we set ourselves up for success, because we always going to have catastrophic events. We always going to… What’s next? I’m in New Orleans where we have hurricanes every year.

Dawn McGruer:

We’re just going to be rolling to the next one.

Michelle Seiler:

Right. So, you need to prepare for that. You need to plan for that, so the next catastrophic event won’t be so catastrophic for you.

Dawn McGruer:

What’s been the biggest resource that you’ve really taken inspiration from? Be it a mentor or a book, something that’s made an impact in your life.

Michelle Seiler:

I never had a mentor until probably 2012, 2013, 2014. I would say, probably what makes the biggest impact for me, number one is me. I’m self-motivated, I’m determined. I’m going to win. I’m competitive. I’m resilient. I think I’m, probably my best resource. However, yes, there’s books I read. Like I read Think and Grow Rich from Napoleon Hill Foundation. The Art of The Deal by Donald Trump. Love him or hate him, it’s a good book. The One Thing by Gary Keller. Rich Dad Poor Dad. I have had some mentors along the way, but I think for me, because I’ve owned so many different businesses, I know what it takes. It doesn’t matter what your industry is. It doesn’t matter if it’s service product, whatever, the steps are the same. The infrastructure is the same.

Dawn McGruer:

It’s mindset really for you. This is a big thing. I think even listening to you for five, 10 minutes, you’re a very energized person, and I think we could all get energized with you within that time. I’m now thinking I’m going to go away and review my business and look at everything that we’re going to be doing. But if people want to go and connect with you, Michelle, how can they get in touch? And most importantly, how can they get a copy of Exit Rich? Bearing in mind our listeners and viewers are all over the globe.

Michelle Seiler:

Okay. To get in touch with me, they can do a couple of things. They can go to my website, seilertucker.com. That’s seilertucker.com. They can text Michelle to 888 526 5750. When they do that, all my social media pops up, plus my websites pop up. You can go there, follow me on Facebook, LinkedIn, connect with me on LinkedIn. Then for Exit Rich, I strongly encourage everyone to go get Exit Rich. Because we didn’t really cover the six Ps, we didn’t cover evaluation, negotiations, creating a bidding war. So much stuff we didn’t cover. It’s all in the book, so I encourage everybody to go get the book. Sharon Lechter, by the way, is my co-author. She wrote Rich Dad Poor Dad with Robert Kiyosaki. So she’s a five times New York Times best selling author.

Plus she’s a CPA, a financial literacy expert and the advisor of many different presidents. Then Steve Forbes also has endorsed Exit Rich, plus Kevin Harrington, which is the original shark on Shark Tank, wrote the foreword. They can get exitrichbook.com now at exitrichbook.com. And it won’t be out till June. However, we will email you the digital download. Anyone in United States, we will send the hardcover to your doorstep. Outside the United States, you just have to pay extra for shipping. Then we will also give you a lifetime membership to the Exit Rich Book Club. The Exit Rich Book Club is me doing video training on all these different… How to create a bidding war, negotiations, five types of buyers, the six Ps. Then also documents, so all the documents you need to run your business and sell your business. A lot of times business owners say, “Michelle, I never saw a non-compete or employee handbook, or organizational chart,” it’s there. We also have sample letters…

Dawn McGruer:

All the bits, everything they need in one stop shop.

Michelle Seiler:

We also have sample letter of intent, because the letter of intent is very important if you want to sell your business. Sample purchase agreements, due diligence checklist, and closing dots. They’re all there, not just for your review, but for your download. These documents alone are worth over $25,000. So hot.

Dawn McGruer:

That’s enough of a reason to go check out the website. So, why-

Michelle Seiler:

Well, there’s one more thing I want to say. They also, if they provide pre-buy the book, they get a 30 day membership in The Club CEOs. And Club CEOs is an entrepreneur mastermind that I founded when we do hot seats Q&A’s and help business owners really pivot and figure out what they need to do next.

Michelle’s final words of inspiration

Dawn McGruer:

Perfect. Well, one final question that I have for you, Michelle, before we leave our live listeners. Because there is so much that people could go, and obviously from a resource point of view, they can get the book. They can contact you. But if you have one thing that you could tell our listeners and viewers that would stick with them, something either a quote or a story, what would that be?

Michelle Seiler:

A quote that I came up with a long time ago, that I always use, is my quote actually, I’m not stealing this one. It’s my quote. It’s hard to read the label from the inside of the bottle. You need an outsider’s perspective to read the warning signs, and keep you out of the danger zone. So align yourself with a mentor, get an expert, get somebody who’s been down the road that you want to travel. Learn from someone else’s mistakes, instead of making them on your own. You don’t have to make mistakes, because you can always find somebody else to learn from, and it will shorten your learning curve dramatically. And your path to success will be so much greater.

Dawn McGruer:

Brilliant. Well, Michelle, you have been inspirational and very energetic in the way that you’ve delivered everything. I think people will be thinking differently, and this is what this podcast is about. Come and check out Dawn of a New Era at dawnmcgruer.com. And again, when we post all of this across social media, you could always connect with Michelle, we will tag her in everything. Thank you for being a marvelous guest.

Michelle Seiler:

Thank you.

Dawn McGruer:

And what have you planned for the rest of the day?

Michelle Seiler:

Thank you, Dawn. Thank you so much for having me. It’s been an absolute pleasure. I can’t wait to read your book.

Dawn McGruer:

What are you going to be doing the rest of the day, Michelle? What’s your plans?

Michelle Seiler:

Podcast.

I think I have another five today, then in between I work with clients.

Dawn McGruer:

Do you know what – podcast, honestly. I see the fact that podcasts are growing massively at the moment. I only started our podcast last July and we’ve hit the top 10% in global reach. So, very powerful medium. I think something that way more people can be using, especially in the pandemic when people are walking, but great resources. I’m sure we’re going to be seeing you everywhere, Michelle, but thank you so much for joining today.

Michelle Seiler:

Thank you.

Dawn McGruer:

Really appreciate it. Thank you. Take care.

Michelle Seiler:

Thank you for having me. Thank you.

Dawn McGruer:

I hope you enjoyed this week’s episode and don’t forget, I’m going to be with you each and every week. So, download and listen on dawnmcgruer.com or on iTunes. And come and join us in our Facebook community too. All the details are on the website, and I’ll see you next week.

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